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UMPIRE

4:1 - Red Sonja vs. The Punisher

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SEASON 4, ROUND 1

Red Sonja

Slot: Keeping The Team Real
Season Wins: 0
Season Losses: 0
Fantasy Team Page
Read more about Red Sonja at Wikipedia
Official Site: Roy Thomas



The Punisher

Slot: Keeping The Team Real
Season Wins: 0
Season Losses: 0
Fantasy Team Page
Read more about The Punisher at Wikipedia
Official Site: Marvel Comics



Battle Terrain
Prison Break

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3 minutes ago, Bergy_Berg said:

Does Red Sonja have anything here that would put her over Punisher?

Well... she's escaping from prison and there's no weapons or gear allowed.

She may have some Natural Assets that could be useful here.  Possibly.

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4 minutes ago, Bergy_Berg said:

Does Red Sonja have anything here that would put her over Punisher?

If they both have no gear or weapons, then Sonja takes this. She's physically stronger than Frank and faster.

Plus, she has the bonus of men underestimating her. She lures them with her 'Natural Assets', then breaks their bones until she gets what she wants. This would work on the guards too.

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9 minutes ago, Bergy_Berg said:

Does Red Sonja have anything here that would put her over Punisher?

Pretty sure Sonja has been gifted with fighting skills, so she's better in the hand-to-hand.

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Good points. But Frank Castle is pretty capable without guns as well. He wouldn't have any real issues breaking out of a common jail.

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47 minutes ago, Bergy_Berg said:

Good points. But Frank Castle is pretty capable without guns as well. He wouldn't have any real issues breaking out of a common jail.

Prison > common jail

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Yeah no gear really fucks The Punisher her, he's definitely in a pickle. Red Sonja will probably be out of here a lot easier than he would, and with the added benefit of probably not even needing to kill anyone. Or hurt them for that matter.

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1 hour ago, Versam said:

Pretty sure Sonja has been gifted with fighting skills, so she's better in the hand-to-hand.

That's debatable. Frank is skilled in around a dozen martial arts himself.

Also, having fought in the Vietnam War and against some of Marvel's harshest street-level characters, the Punisher is definitely no stranger to harsh conditions.

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11 minutes ago, DSkillz said:

That's debatable. Frank is skilled in around a dozen martial arts himself.

Also, having fought in the Vietnam War and against some of Marvel's harshest street-level characters, the Punisher is definitely no stranger to harsh conditions.

Just looked through the Savage Avengers, which feature The Punisher and Conan The Barbarian prominently. We see them work together and in #6 Conan kills a dinosaur before Frank could see or hear it behind him. Conan starts killing things almost too fast for Frank to react.

I bring this up as Red Sonja scales to Conan. And we see Conan with faster reflexes and sharper senses (based on the comic). I'd say that's evidence that Red Sonja has Frank beat in those two categories. She'd take him in a hand-to-hand brawl and she has the superhuman skills necessary to escape prison faster than Frank would.

I think the winner is clear.

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Being more physically gifted... In a couple way... Doesn't necessarily make this a clear Red Sonja win. If she comes up against something that she can't just break through then that poses a real challenge to her.

Frank has the better skills as far as planning and bypassing security systems go. And he's more than capable of incapacitating guards. Unless this prison has T-rex patrols Sonja's strength and speed may not offer that robust of an advantage.

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Every time I see boobs, I will give the UMPIRE a point.

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Just now, Venom 2009 said:

Every time I see boobs, I will give the UMPIRE a point.

I think this time you're kinda correct though.

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Sometimes I wonder if I'm the only married man in this community...

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3 hours ago, Bergy_Berg said:

Frank has the better skills as far as planning and bypassing security systems go. 

Is that a fancy way of saying that he's..... smarter?

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23 minutes ago, Versam said:

Is that a fancy way of saying that he's..... smarter?

In terms of raw intelligence I have no clue who's smarter. But Castle has special forces training and does infiltration and stuff, so I believe he's better able to handle parts of this.

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3 hours ago, SSJRuss said:

Just looked through the Savage Avengers, which feature The Punisher and Conan The Barbarian prominently. We see them work together and in #6 Conan kills a dinosaur before Frank could see or hear it behind him. Conan starts killing things almost too fast for Frank to react.

I bring this up as Red Sonja scales to Conan. And we see Conan with faster reflexes and sharper senses (based on the comic). I'd say that's evidence that Red Sonja has Frank beat in those two categories. She'd take him in a hand-to-hand brawl and she has the superhuman skills necessary to escape prison faster than Frank would.

I think the winner is clear.

Heh, if we want to talk physical abilities, comics tend to have inconsistent showings. While there is that comic with Frank barely being able to follow Conan's movements, there's another comic where Frank and Black Widow fight to a standstill using nothing but hand-to-hand combat. Conan is still considered to not quite be superhuman physically, and so is Black Widow. If Sonja's physicals scale to Conan's, it stands to reason that Punisher at least stands a strong chance against her in a fight.

Besides that, with all the variables here it may not even come down to the two fighting to escape. It may also come down to what type of prison they're being held in. I'd say if the prison is from the modern era, Punisher might have a better chance to escape, since various versions of Sonja are from previous eras.

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https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/4url3n/respect_red_sonja_red_sonja/

Her sneak feats are impressive though. If she can sneak up on a deer, she isn't going to have any issues with guards.

 

Conversely, Frank's respect thread. Impressive feats, but not quite the same level of stealthiness. Just my opinion.

https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/5hsrop/respect_frank_castle_the_punisher_marvel_earth616/

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Had to change to my other comp to see those respect threads.

59 minutes ago, SSJRuss said:

https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/4url3n/respect_red_sonja_red_sonja/

Her sneak feats are impressive though. If she can sneak up on a deer, she isn't going to have any issues with guards.

 

Conversely, Frank's respect thread. Impressive feats, but not quite the same level of stealthiness. Just my opinion.

https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/5hsrop/respect_frank_castle_the_punisher_marvel_earth616/

Heh, Frank's infiltration section alone shows his more varied skill with different facilities, etc.

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I mean, Frank will actually understand what a modern prison is, which Sonja shouldn’t, right?

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5 hours ago, Magnamax said:

I mean, Frank will actually understand what a modern prison is, which Sonja shouldn’t, right?

I don't know, I mean a prison is a prison right? 

I think most people who are sent to one figure them out real quick.  They just don't have the talents to escape.

Escape from Alcatraz is based on a true account. Observation + Planning + Opportunity = Escape.

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5 minutes ago, Fox said:

I don't know, I mean a prison is a prison right? 

I think most people who are sent to one figure them out real quick.  They just don't have the talents to escape.

Escape from Alcatraz is based on a true account. Observation + Planning + Opportunity = Escape.

I guess I mean that The Punisher going in being familiar with prisons and having escaped them before should give him something of a head start. 
 

Sonja would presumably not be familiar with a modern prison structure and would take at least some time to get familiar with it. If the scenario is a race to see who gets out first, I think this would be significant for the victor.
 

here’s some examples: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbr.com/punisher-prison-escapes/amp/

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