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#81 Jaeger Panzer

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Posted 21 September 2010 - 03:17 PM

I thought the Infinity Gauntlet controlled all things within the Marvel Multiverse (except LT & TOAA)? Meaning, every story, arc, character that falls under the Marvel Comics banner, no matter what reality, dimension, or universe they fall under, the Infinity Gauntlet controls everything? If so, then it shouldn't matter where Jugg's helmet is from or where he gets his power from, or where Cyttorak himself is hiding.

That seems kinda lame and anti-climactic if it only works in Earth-616 reality. But I'm fairly sure that's not accurate. Because if that was true, then the I.G. shouldn't effect Juggernaut (even in Earth-616) because his powers/armor/helmet are from another dimension.

An individual gem doesn't nearly have as much power as the completed IG...

A major difference there.

#82 Dreadlock

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Posted 21 September 2010 - 03:20 PM

I know, but the Mind Gem itself controls all aspects of (every) reality (under the Marvel name) for that distinct part of existence. It should have no problem bypassing whatever armor or helmet anyone has.

#83 Jaeger Panzer

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Posted 21 September 2010 - 05:29 PM

I know, but the Mind Gem itself controls all aspects of (every) reality (under the Marvel name) for that distinct part of existence. It should have no problem bypassing whatever armor or helmet anyone has.

Mh, the full power of the Cyttorak Gem can shatter realities. That gives the Gem of Cyttorak a win over the reality thing, does it not? Not to mention, you have the backing of a god... who can shatter realities with mere punches...

And it does not control all aspects of all realities, only the mental aspects. That's the Reality Gem's job. -.-

#84 Omega11

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Posted 22 September 2010 - 10:43 AM

I thought the Infinity Gauntlet controlled all things within the Marvel Multiverse (except LT & TOAA)? Meaning, every story, arc, character that falls under the Marvel Comics banner, no matter what reality, dimension, or universe they fall under, the Infinity Gauntlet controls everything? If so, then it shouldn't matter where Jugg's helmet is from or where he gets his power from, or where Cyttorak himself is hiding.

That seems kinda lame and anti-climactic if it only works in Earth-616 reality. But I'm fairly sure that's not accurate. Because if that was true, then the I.G. shouldn't effect Juggernaut (even in Earth-616) because his powers/armor/helmet are from another dimension.


No, the Infinity Gauntlet was restricted to 616. That's why Thanos basically took Eternity's place, if it were the entire Multiverse, then he would basically have been taking the Living Tribunal's place.

I know, but the Mind Gem itself controls all aspects of (every) reality (under the Marvel name) for that distinct part of existence. It should have no problem bypassing whatever armor or helmet anyone has.


As Jaeger said, the Mind Gem alone isn't as powerful as when it's combined with the others(specifically the Power Gem).

On it's own, think of it more that the Mind Gem can access all mental planes in Marvel 616, but without the Power Gem to back it, it can't necessarily control everything.

It's more of a scope than a gun(not the best metaphor, but it'll do for now).

#85 Dreadlock

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 02:06 AM

Well then, the Mind Gem backed by the Power Gem would certainly be able to bypass his armor. I just thought, in the beginning, that every individual gem controlled its aspect of the universe completely. Of course they become stronger and more powerful when backed by the Power Gem, but I was sure the Mind Gem would have no problem by itself.


And WOW! I am shocked that the I.G. only works in the Earth-616 reality! :o I thought it was everything under "Marvel Comics" period.



Do you guys know anything about the seventh Gem (Ego) and how it complements the other six Gems? Here is what I know so far:

EGO -- The seventh gem. It contains the consciousness of the cosmic entity Nemesis, which when united with the other gems reforms the character. This gem is found in the Ultraverse when the Asgardian god Loki attempts to steal the other gems. It has never been referenced since.

WHat does that mean? How does that work with the other gems and/or what does it do for the one who controls it? What about if used against another being?

#86 Jaeger Panzer

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 06:56 AM

Well then, the Mind Gem backed by the Power Gem would certainly be able to bypass his armor. I just thought, in the beginning, that every individual gem controlled its aspect of the universe completely. Of course they become stronger and more powerful when backed by the Power Gem, but I was sure the Mind Gem would have no problem by itself.


And WOW! I am shocked that the I.G. only works in the Earth-616 reality! :o I thought it was everything under "Marvel Comics" period.



Do you guys know anything about the seventh Gem (Ego) and how it complements the other six Gems? Here is what I know so far:

EGO -- The seventh gem. It contains the consciousness of the cosmic entity Nemesis, which when united with the other gems reforms the character. This gem is found in the Ultraverse when the Asgardian god Loki attempts to steal the other gems. It has never been referenced since.

WHat does that mean? How does that work with the other gems and/or what does it do for the one who controls it? What about if used against another being?

It held Nemesis within and when it met the other gems, he reformed and fought the Avengers, I think, but he was defeated. Since then, the Ego gem has not been seen ever. I don't think it has any powers unless it comes into contact with the others and all it does is reform Nemesis.

#87 Dreadlock

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 03:17 PM

Also, couldn't the Infinity Gauntlet make other beings from other realities appear in the 616 reality? I would assume because of the Space Gem, Soul Gem, and Reality Gem, they'd be able to pull whatever being they wanted to wherever they wanted them... then wreck them accordingly. :o

i.e. Cyttorak himself would be screwed if the Infinty Gauntlet wearer was coming after him... even if he was hiding in his own reality.

#88 Jaeger Panzer

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 03:25 PM

Hulk can most definitely crush Adamantium.

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#89 Omega11

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 12:21 PM

Also, couldn't the Infinity Gauntlet make other beings from other realities appear in the 616 reality? I would assume because of the Space Gem, Soul Gem, and Reality Gem, they'd be able to pull whatever being they wanted to wherever they wanted them... then wreck them accordingly. :o

i.e. Cyttorak himself would be screwed if the Infinty Gauntlet wearer was coming after him... even if he was hiding in his own reality.


Again, the Gems have no power outside of Marvel 616. That's one thing they got right in the Avengers/JLA crossover, the Gauntlet didn't work in the DC universe because it doesn't control those aspects of that universe.

Hulk can most definitely crush Adamantium.

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Thor's hammer isn't made of Adamantium...

#90 Jaeger Panzer

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 03:42 PM

Thor's hammer isn't made of Adamantium...

I know... you could go further beyond what I said...

We know Thor's Hammer is stronger than Adamantium.

For one, it dented a cylinder of pure adamantium with no damage to the hammer itself.

A cylinder that was thicker than the Hammer BTW.

#91 force_echo

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 07:25 AM

An individual gem doesn't nearly have as much power as the completed IG...

A major difference there.

Exactly why they split the gems up.

#92 ND7

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 01:16 PM

Would Sliver Samurai's powers affect Cap's shield since it said it couldn't cut trough Adamantium?

What other things beside Cap's shield are made out of Vibranium?

If held long enough, would Cyclops' beam get through Cap's shield or Wolverines skelton.(Correct me if I'm wrong but I read somewhere that said Cyke almost killed Logan.)

#93 force_echo

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 05:44 PM

Would Sliver Samurai's powers affect Cap's shield since it said it couldn't cut trough Adamantium?

What other things beside Cap's shield are made out of Vibranium?

If held long enough, would Cyclops' beam get through Cap's shield or Wolverines skelton.(Correct me if I'm wrong but I read somewhere that said Cyke almost killed Logan.)

Black Panther has his suit laced with vibranium, Stark Towers is made of a Vibranium-concrete mixture. Cap's beam wouldnt be able to get through Wolverine's skeleton or Cap's Sheild.

#94 Dreadlock

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 10:42 PM

I know... you could go further beyond what I said...

We know Thor's Hammer is stronger than Adamantium.

For one, it dented a cylinder of pure adamantium with no damage to the hammer itself.

A cylinder that was thicker than the Hammer BTW.


That was retcon'd to be only secondary Adamantium (like the statue).

And no, Thor's Hammer isn't stronger than Adamantium. Adamantium is far more durable than his hammer w/o mystic powerups. After all, Classic Thor with his basic hammer (the one Hulk broke) can't affect Adamantium if it hits it. Adamantium is too durable. It is only when the hammer is charged with Odinforce/Thorforce that it can affect Primary Adamantium.

I've already posted the quote where it says Thor's hammer is capable of collapsing mountains with a single blow, but Primary Adamantium withstands it and is too durable for it.


Again, the Gems have no power outside of Marvel 616. That's one thing they got right in the Avengers/JLA crossover, the Gauntlet didn't work in the DC universe because it doesn't control those aspects of that universe.


Well, yeah, that's because it's not in the same Multiverse. DC/Marvel are COMPLETELY different things altogether. Two different companys, so it makes sense that certain powers don't cross over. (Just like the Anti-Life Equation is worthless to Thanos)

But I'm saying under the Marvel Banner, can't the character wearing the I.G. in Earth-616 reality pull beings from other realities, such as Cyttorak, into Earth-616 reality (as long as they are under the Marvel Comics banner)?

Example: Thanos wears the Infinity Gauntlet in 616 reality holds out his hand and says "Cyttorak, wherever you are, I will you to stand before me." then Cyttorak appears? It makes sense, especially with the Reality Gem being backed by the Power Gem (as well as all the other gems).


Also, to be honest, I've never seen anything that says the Infinity Gauntlet only works in Earth-616 reality. The only place I've seen it fail was the DC universe, and, well...duh! Totally different company. But otherwise, the I.G. should span all of the Marvel Omniverse. (Marvel Omniverse = all (Marvel) Multiverses within = Everything under the Marvel company name) Or, at the very least, it should work in most of the Marvel Omniverse. But to have such a powerful item limited to a single reality seems kind of.... anti-climactic.

#95 Jaeger Panzer

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 09:33 AM

That was retcon'd to be only secondary Adamantium (like the statue).

And no, Thor's Hammer isn't stronger than Adamantium. Adamantium is far more durable than his hammer w/o mystic powerups. After all, Classic Thor with his basic hammer (the one Hulk broke) can't affect Adamantium if it hits it. Adamantium is too durable. It is only when the hammer is charged with Odinforce/Thorforce that it can affect Primary Adamantium.

I've already posted the quote where it says Thor's hammer is capable of collapsing mountains with a single blow, but Primary Adamantium withstands it and is too durable for it.

Yeah, never said it was PRIMARY Adamantium.

Actually, the Hammer's been enchanted, so its not "basic" at all, its a magically enchanted hammer, Uru and the enchantments on it... which makes it tougher than Adamantium, but not Primary and Beta.

I do recall me never specifying Primary. I said Adamantium. How much Adamantium is there specifically? More of the weaker stuff than Primary and Beta, obviously.

#96 Dreadlock

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Posted 27 September 2010 - 12:46 AM

Yeah, never said it was PRIMARY Adamantium.

Actually, the Hammer's been enchanted, so its not "basic" at all, its a magically enchanted hammer, Uru and the enchantments on it... which makes it tougher than Adamantium, but not Primary and Beta.

I do recall me never specifying Primary. I said Adamantium. How much Adamantium is there specifically? More of the weaker stuff than Primary and Beta, obviously.


Gotcha. But just for the sake of people like me who don't fully understand when you just say "Adamantium" in general, maybe just throw "Secondary" in there ahead of it. Because "Secondary Adamantium" is basically any form of Adamantium with defects in it (i.e. why it is cheaper to make and there is a ton more of it). Primary is absolutely clean, with no defects whatsoever.

But don't get me wrong, Secondary Adamantium is outragiously strong and durable, just not to the degree of Primary.

#97 sirmethos

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Posted 27 September 2010 - 05:21 AM

Would Sliver Samurai's powers affect Cap's shield since it said it couldn't cut trough Adamantium?

What other things beside Cap's shield are made out of Vibranium?

If held long enough, would Cyclops' beam get through Cap's shield or Wolverines skelton.(Correct me if I'm wrong but I read somewhere that said Cyke almost killed Logan.)


in Age of Apocalypse Cyclops was able to cut through Logans skeleton, thats how Logan lost his left hand.

#98 Omega11

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Posted 27 September 2010 - 11:47 AM

Well, yeah, that's because it's not in the same Multiverse. DC/Marvel are COMPLETELY different things altogether. Two different companys, so it makes sense that certain powers don't cross over. (Just like the Anti-Life Equation is worthless to Thanos)

But I'm saying under the Marvel Banner, can't the character wearing the I.G. in Earth-616 reality pull beings from other realities, such as Cyttorak, into Earth-616 reality (as long as they are under the Marvel Comics banner)?

Example: Thanos wears the Infinity Gauntlet in 616 reality holds out his hand and says "Cyttorak, wherever you are, I will you to stand before me." then Cyttorak appears? It makes sense, especially with the Reality Gem being backed by the Power Gem (as well as all the other gems).


Also, to be honest, I've never seen anything that says the Infinity Gauntlet only works in Earth-616 reality. The only place I've seen it fail was the DC universe, and, well...duh! Totally different company. But otherwise, the I.G. should span all of the Marvel Omniverse. (Marvel Omniverse = all (Marvel) Multiverses within = Everything under the Marvel company name) Or, at the very least, it should work in most of the Marvel Omniverse. But to have such a powerful item limited to a single reality seems kind of.... anti-climactic.


Complete and total control over an entire universe isn't enough?

If the Gauntlet granted power over all of the Marvel Multiverse, then the Living Tribunal wouldn't have been able to just pwn it like he did.

Again, if the Gauntlet were multiversal in scale, Thanos would have been usurping the Tribunal's position, not Eternity's.

#99 Dreadlock

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Posted 27 September 2010 - 05:29 PM

Complete and total control over an entire universe isn't enough?

If the Gauntlet granted power over all of the Marvel Multiverse, then the Living Tribunal wouldn't have been able to just pwn it like he did.

Again, if the Gauntlet were multiversal in scale, Thanos would have been usurping the Tribunal's position, not Eternity's.


Having complete and absolute control over the main universe within Marvel is fine. It's just, does that then mean that if an inter-dimensional being leaves the Earth-616 reality and hides in another universe that they will then be safe from the wielder of the Infinity Gauntlet? You would think that all the gems combined (especially the Reality Gem backed by the Power Gem) would be more than enough to simply will whatever being they wished wherever they wished, no matter where they were. It is kind of anti-climacitc if certain beings can just run away and hide from it in alternate realities.

#100 Omega11

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Posted 28 September 2010 - 11:14 AM

Having complete and absolute control over the main universe within Marvel is fine. It's just, does that then mean that if an inter-dimensional being leaves the Earth-616 reality and hides in another universe that they will then be safe from the wielder of the Infinity Gauntlet? You would think that all the gems combined (especially the Reality Gem backed by the Power Gem) would be more than enough to simply will whatever being they wished wherever they wished, no matter where they were. It is kind of anti-climacitc if certain beings can just run away and hide from it in alternate realities.


Well whoever has the Gauntlet could always stop time, or rewind it to before whoever it was left.

Of course, that is interesting on how that last part might work if they're in a different universe which the Gauntlet can't affect. Maybe rewinding time wouldn't bring that person back, maybe it would bring them back but they would also still be in the other universe(creating some sort of temporal paradox/clone thing), maybe it would create a sort of vaccum effect which would reach into the other universe and pull them back. I would consider the second option the most likely.

Of course that's all assuming that rolling back time would need to affect the fleeing person at all. If it's just traveling to the past, it shouldn't matter. In which case you could kill that person in the past(before they left), and then they would cease to exist in the present(after they've escaped).

Time travel makes my head hurt.




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