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Rumble 14437 Carnage vs. Iron Patriot vs. Silver Samurai


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#1 badpierce

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Posted 01 July 2013 - 06:23 AM

Arcade has kidnapped every supervillain who has ever made fun of him and brought them to his new murder world. He splits up the 27 villains in to groups of 3 and forces them to fight each other to the Death in gladiator style matches. Only the one villain that survives will be set free at the end.

 

Round 1:6 

Silver Samurai vs Carnage vs Iron Patriot 

Fight takes place in Raccoon City.

 



#2 Callisto

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Posted 01 July 2013 - 06:23 AM

Learn More About
Carnage
Read more about Carnage at Wikipedia
Official Site: Marvel Comics Links: Wikipedia: Carnage Spiderfan.org: Carnage Marvel.com: Carnage

Iron Patriot
Read more about Iron Patriot at Wikipedia
Official Site: MARVEL Links: Wikipedia Wired.com io9.com

Silver Samurai
Read more about Silver Samurai at Wikipedia
Official Site: Marvel Entertainment Links: Wikipedia Marvel.com Comicvine



#3 thanosisawesome

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Posted 01 July 2013 - 07:08 AM

Iron Patriot.



#4 Dr. Pymp(mex)

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 02:16 AM

If Silver Samurai has his teleporter device, he can win, as his power is to be able to channel energy to his sword allowing it to cut through anything. Carnage equals anything, and so does the other guy.

 

 

       However, I see Carnage winning overall.



#5 AVP vs The Terminator

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 08:08 AM

Cutting through Carnage won't do anything lol.

Didn't he like beat Iron Man recently enough or something?

#6 bigballerju

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 09:56 AM

Carnage beat the Avengers in Carnage U.S.A and took control over them during that series since he could spread himself all over. He survived Sentry ripping him in half in space and leaving him up there. If Ironman had trouble then I doubt Norman with his old Iron Patriot suit which doesn't have half of what Stark's later suits have would really do anything. Silver Samurai wouldn't really do much either. Carnage on the other hand could spread his symbote and take control of them both.



#7 comic_book_fan

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 10:26 AM

carnage wins.



#8 force_echo

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 03:27 PM

Carnage beat the Avengers in Carnage U.S.A and took control over them during that series since he could spread himself all over. He survived Sentry ripping him in half in space and leaving him up there. If Ironman had trouble then I doubt Norman with his old Iron Patriot suit which doesn't have half of what Stark's later suits have would really do anything. Silver Samurai wouldn't really do much either. Carnage on the other hand could spread his symbote and take control of them both.

Except that roster didn't have Iron Man in it.

 

And no, Carnage didn't beat Iron Man. He temporarily disabled him by infecting his OS with... a biological contaminate... Somehow... I don't know, it didn't really make any sense and Iron Man didn't use any of his heat or sonic weaponry during the entire fight for some odd reason. But Iron Man came back and beat Carnage to a pulp.



#9 sirmethos

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 03:29 PM

Except that roster didn't have Iron Man in it.

 

And no, Carnage didn't beat Iron Man. He temporarily disabled him by infecting his OS with... a biological contaminate... Somehow... I don't know, it didn't really make any sense and Iron Man didn't use any of his heat or sonic weaponry during the entire fight for some odd reason. But Iron Man came back and beat Carnage to a pulp.

 

Comics Mechanics/PIS.

 

 

Things like that, is why I prefer not to use fights that has happened in comics, as examples of what characters can or cannot do.



#10 bigballerju

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 03:54 PM

Comics Mechanics/PIS.

 

 

Things like that, is why I prefer not to use fights that has happened in comics, as examples of what characters can or cannot do.
 

 

Your correct on that but their still canon though. As far as Carnage vs Ironman I'm sorry I meant the Carnage series before Carnage U.S.A where Spiderman and Ironman took him on. 



#11 sirmethos

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 04:32 PM

Your correct on that but their still canon though. As far as Carnage vs Ironman I'm sorry I meant the Carnage series before Carnage U.S.A where Spiderman and Ironman took him on. 

 

Of course they're canon, what does that have to do with anything?

 

Spider-Man defeating Firelord is canon as well.

 

So is the entire WWH arc.

 

So is several of Squirrel Girl's victories.

 

So is Black Panther putting Silver Surfer in a restraining hold.

 

 

That doesn't necessarily mean that we use those examples, when explaining or showing what the character is actually capable of, or what he/she is not capable of.

 

If someone makes a match called Spider-Man vs. Firelord, the only thing they're gonna get, is a bunch of comments saying how it's a stomp match in Firelord's favor, and anyone making an argument for Spider-Man, is gonna get laughed out of the thread.  But Spider-Man defeating Firelord is still canon.

 

To repeat myself: That is why I don't like using fights that has happened in the comics, as examples of what character can or cannot do.

 

There are always more factors, in a fight in the comics, than the capabilities of the characters.  And those factors are, as a general rule, not included in the matches here.   In the matches here, there is no one who has the advantage simply because they're the hero, or primary villain, or the comic/story arc, there is no one who has an advantage because they are important to the plot, etc. etc.

 

Using fights from the comics, to argue in a match, is stupid.  Unless you add those factors to the match as well.



#12 comic_book_fan

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 04:36 PM

Of course they're canon, what does that have to do with anything?

 

Spider-Man defeating Firelord is canon as well.

 

So is the entire WWH arc.

 

So is several of Squirrel Girl's victories.

 

So is Black Panther putting Silver Surfer in a restraining hold.

 

 

That doesn't necessarily mean that we use those examples, when explaining or showing what the character is actually capable of, or what he/she is not capable of.

 

If someone makes a match called Spider-Man vs. Firelord, the only thing they're gonna get, is a bunch of comments saying how it's a stomp match in Firelord's favor, and anyone making an argument for Spider-Man, is gonna get laughed out of the thread.  But Spider-Man defeating Firelord is still canon.

 

To repeat myself: That is why I don't like using fights that has happened in the comics, as examples of what character can or cannot do.

 

There are always more factors, in a fight in the comics, than the capabilities of the characters.  And those factors are, as a general rule, not included in the matches here.   In the matches here, there is no one who has the advantage simply because they're the hero, or primary villain, or the comic/story arc, there is no one who has an advantage because they are important to the plot, etc. etc.

 

Using fights from the comics, to argue in a match, is stupid.  Unless you add those factors to the match as well.

I agree with you on most things but what if it's a character trait that causes someone to lose if you take the character out of it your just comparing powers which isn't what we are doing here either.



#13 Dinsdale Piranha

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 04:40 PM

I've got to agree with SirMethos. Somewhere, sometime, somebody came up with a hierarchy of evidence that allows a lot of nonsense to have undo influence in there discussions. To say all canon is equal gives incompetent writers and illogical stories as much weight as good ones.

 

About Carnage; I can understand how the symbiote could recover from extreme damage , like being torn in half, but how does the human host manage? 



#14 sirmethos

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 05:51 PM

I agree with you on most things but what if it's a character trait that causes someone to lose if you take the character out of it your just comparing powers which isn't what we are doing here either.

 

The character's personality is a part of their "capabilities" by proxy.  Not because it gives(or removes) any powers or skills in and of itself, but because it affects how effectively those skills and powers are/can be used by the character.

 

I'm not suggesting taking the personality/character out of the comparison, when trying to determine a winner.  I'm saying that the various extra factors that play into the outcome of fights in the comics, do not have any part of the matches we discuss here.

 

 

 

 

I've got to agree with SirMethos. Somewhere, sometime, somebody came up with a hierarchy of evidence that allows a lot of nonsense to have undo influence in there discussions. To say all canon is equal gives incompetent writers and illogical stories as much weight as good ones.

 

About Carnage; I can understand how the symbiote could recover from extreme damage , like being torn in half, but how does the human host manage? 

 

The host gets repaired/healed by the Symbiote.



#15 force_echo

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 06:46 PM

I've got to agree with SirMethos. Somewhere, sometime, somebody came up with a hierarchy of evidence that allows a lot of nonsense to have undo influence in there discussions. To say all canon is equal gives incompetent writers and illogical stories as much weight as good ones.

 

About Carnage; I can understand how the symbiote could recover from extreme damage , like being torn in half, but how does the human host manage? 

Cletus was ripped in half and near death. The Symbiote kept him alive enough so that when they recovered the symbiote they found Cletus as well.

 

Also, it could just be that Iron Man didn't know that symbiotes were weak to fire and sonics. I don't think he's fought Venom or Carnage before (could be wrong about that though) and Spider-Man neglected to mention it.



#16 AVP vs The Terminator

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 07:08 PM

He'd probably know anyway. People like Toxin and Hybrid went along with the SRA/Initiative stuff so he'd have more than likely been made aware of their strengths and weaknesses.

There was also this one time with that Mighty Avengers team (Stark, Ares, Ms Marvel, Sentry, Wasp, etc) when Doctor Doom dropped like a Symbiote bomb or something on New York. Memory's hazy (mostly because it was written by Bendis) but... yeah.

Was really most likely just a case of the writer wanting to make Carnage seem super awesome and everything, since it was his comeback after something like five years and all.

#17 bigballerju

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 10:32 PM

Carnage had upgraded symbotes from Michael Hall as well when he fought Spiderman and Ironman. He gave them a hard time and escaped. Although their were other factors like Scorn, Shriek, and others there. It was a miniseries that took place before Carnage U.S.A. Ironman knows about Carnage. Ironman's computer before that when Carnage was originally killed by Sentry told him Kassidy may not have been inside the suit Sentry ripped it in half. Although his computer ended up being wrong since Kassidy did die but the symbote preserved his body and Michael Hall later fixed Kassidy up. I do remember Ironman trying to blast Carnage multiple times during the battle and it failed due to Carnage being more powerful with the symbotes so he quickly could spread his symbote to attack. Ironman did not use sonics and I don't think he had it on him. Shriek ended up being the one to use her sonic attack in that battle to beat Carnage before he escaped with Doppelganger.

 

I had the series. If I could find it I would upload scans. I'll see.



#18 force_echo

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Posted 18 July 2013 - 10:08 AM

"He didn't have it on him". What? This literally makes no sense. He had a sonic burst that quickly incapacitated every single metahuman on the battlefield except Hercules in Civil War, Carnage would freaking melt if he was exposed to that weapon. Or Heat beams that can go past 25,000 degrees Fahrenheit. That would annihilate Carnage. It doesn't really matter, they clearly showed Iron Man beating Carnage down, even when he had absorbed the biomass of other things and became huge Carnage. 



#19 Dinsdale Piranha

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Posted 18 July 2013 - 10:59 AM

So...

 

Iron Patriot has the weapons to annihilate Carnage via either heat or sonics.

But Sliver Samurai can use his teleportation ring to blindside Iron Patriot and has the power to pierce his armor and kill him.

But Carnage can regenerate from anything the Samurai can do and kill him.

 

This is a classic rock, paper, scissors match,



#20 force_echo

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Posted 18 July 2013 - 11:34 AM

He only had the teleportation ring when working with Viper. Norman Osborn has this in the bag. He's got the biggest guns, range, flight, and most importantly, he's the smartest. When he's not unstable.






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