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Battery Capacitor Energy Electric Car Invention

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#1 Skirmisher

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 08:32 AM

http://www.upworthy....-your-battery-l

Your thoughts on this, and what would it mean to you?

#2 Ruinus

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 12:45 AM

That's pretty cool but, as I understand it, it's basically just going to be charged really fast, but only barely competing with fossil fuels right? In terms of kW hours per kg or whatever.

#3 Skirmisher

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 10:28 PM

That's pretty cool but, as I understand it, it's basically just going to be charged really fast, but only barely competing with fossil fuels right? In terms of kW hours per kg or whatever.

Barely competing now maybe, but next week when they up the price of gas again? The week after? How about next month?

Face it, Fossil Fuels aren't Renewable. The More we use the less there's going to be, and supply and demand mean that the price will go up.

The thing about this though is that it means that you won't Need gas for your car. You just need the Electricity. And Electricity can be generated cleanly via Hydro/Wind/Tidal/Solar/Geothermal power plants.

What makes this so revolutionary though is that it's actually better then the lithium Ion batteries they are using now for Electric Cars. In that it only takes a very short while to take a full charge and be on your way. Instead of plugging your car in at night and getting around 100km out of it over the next day, you could zap it, run it along for a 100km, zap it again at a charging station in the same amount of time it would take you to gas up a car, and be on your way for another 100km.

But, it's also for all the other battery powered devices out there. Imagine a Cell Phone or a Laptop that charges in a few dozen seconds and lasts hours before needing another Zap. Now with batteries you need to sit around waiting for it to charge, or plug it in at night when you aren't using it... or hope you did at least.

Another point to it as well is that it's so easy to make. If I had a workshop (if I had a backyard I Would have one) I'd easily be able to make a lab to produce Graphene like this. The only difficulty would be producing the Graphene Oxide, but hey, it's alot more doable then working with Lithium to make a battery.

Not only that, but Graphene can be used for Many other applications. Thin lightweight and strong construction material for instance. This Super Capacitor application was just an Accidental discovery, they were trying to make Graphene sheets for other applications when they found this out.

#4 force_echo

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 10:40 PM

Actually, prices usually go up on gas because of price speculation, not the supply.

Also, this solves one problem but there are others. How long one charge can hold for example, and the fact that a battery is more expensive than the associated gasoline. Also, the fact that electric cars represent a change in infrastructure. if infrastructure was improved and more specialized charging stations were available, more people would buy electric cars. But, of course, changes to infrastructure won't be made until more people buy electric cars and call for it.

#5 Ruinus

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 11:44 PM

Barely competing now maybe, but next week when they up the price of gas again? The week after? How about next month?

Face it, Fossil Fuels aren't Renewable. The More we use the less there's going to be, and supply and demand mean that the price will go up.

The thing about this though is that it means that you won't Need gas for your car. You just need the Electricity. And Electricity can be generated cleanly via Hydro/Wind/Tidal/Solar/Geothermal power plants.

What makes this so revolutionary though is that it's actually better then the lithium Ion batteries they are using now for Electric Cars. In that it only takes a very short while to take a full charge and be on your way. Instead of plugging your car in at night and getting around 100km out of it over the next day, you could zap it, run it along for a 100km, zap it again at a charging station in the same amount of time it would take you to gas up a car, and be on your way for another 100km.


Yes, but in that case its less the battery that would be an amazing improvement and more the entire infrastruction of clean hydro/wind/solar power. These batteries are useless (or at least, not as effective) without that in place, that infrastructure would be great in place even if these graphene batteries didnt' come along. I dunno exactly how the entire thing would be built, but one of these graphene batteries has around 85 Wh/kg, with hopes to improve it to 100 Wh/kg, while gasoline has 12,000 Wh/kg. Even with innefficiencies the gasoline itself already beats it. It'd be great if someone could figure out a way to make these batteries pack alot more energy in it, but most people would probably go "Yeah, those aren't as good as gasoline" and be done with it.

But, it's also for all the other battery powered devices out there. Imagine a Cell Phone or a Laptop that charges in a few dozen seconds and lasts hours before needing another Zap. Now with batteries you need to sit around waiting for it to charge, or plug it in at night when you aren't using it... or hope you did at least.

Another point to it as well is that it's so easy to make. If I had a workshop (if I had a backyard I Would have one) I'd easily be able to make a lab to produce Graphene like this. The only difficulty would be producing the Graphene Oxide, but hey, it's alot more doable then working with Lithium to make a battery.

Not only that, but Graphene can be used for Many other applications. Thin lightweight and strong construction material for instance. This Super Capacitor application was just an Accidental discovery, they were trying to make Graphene sheets for other applications when they found this out.


Yeah, that's cool and all, I'm sure some people would love a laptop that stays on for 6 hours instead of 3 and recharges fully in 5 minutes, but it's not really world changing (we'd still have to generate that electricity with solar/wind/etc elsewhere and send it to the laptop anyway.

Graphene is pretty nifty, but that's more to do with graphene and less with the battery.

#6 Skirmisher

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 11:46 PM

Actually, prices usually go up on gas because of price speculation, not the supply.

And yet, it's theorized that the total global supply of Oil will run out within this century, with speculation placing it within a half century if use keeps growing.

Also, this solves one problem but there are others. How long one charge can hold for example

I'm not sure on the yields of these Super Capacitors, but presumably they could probably match or beat current high energy batteries if I'm not mistaken.


and the fact that a battery is more expensive than the associated gasoline.

And that is also more due to Lithium supplies for Lithium-Ion batteries needed to run these cars. Carbon however is everywhere, and all it takes is some highschool chemistry to produce Graphene Oxide, and with this new Method for producing flat sheets of pure Graphene in large quantities (rather then the previous method of Scotch Tape...) and you have an Abundant Supply of Energy Storage Devices for these cars.


Also, the fact that electric cars represent a change in infrastructure. if infrastructure was improved and more specialized charging stations were available, more people would buy electric cars. But, of course, changes to infrastructure won't be made until more people buy electric cars and call for it.

I'm sure Horse breeders said the same thing back in the late 1800's

#7 Ruinus

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 11:56 PM

100-150 Wh/kg is the expected energy density of the batteries, they are currently at 85 Wh/kg, at least according to that 3 year old article.

#8 Skirmisher

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 11:59 PM

100-150 Wh/kg is the expected energy density of the batteries, they are currently at 85 Wh/kg, at least according to that 3 year old article.

I got a 20 watts per cm3 or about 1.36 milliwatt-hours per cm3 from this site, stating that it's "three orders of magnitude higher than lithium-ion batteries."

#9 force_echo

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 12:31 AM

Yet, like Ruinus said, still less efficient than gasoline, and more expensive up front. And one of my friends did research on using graphene based sensors for the detection of gases, growing Graphene by Chemical Vapor Disposition is definitely nowhere near "high school chemistry". Maybe the Scotch tape method, but that's not used anyway.

#10 Skirmisher

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 12:53 AM

Yet, like Ruinus said, still less efficient than gasoline, and more expensive up front. And one of my friends did research on using graphene based sensors for the detection of gases, growing Graphene by Chemical Vapor Disposition is definitely nowhere near "high school chemistry". Maybe the Scotch tape method, but that's not used anyway.

lol, then you obviously didn't watch the vid in post one...

All they did was take Graphene Oxide, squirt it onto a CD, and burn off the Oxide with a simple DVD Burner.

As I understand it, the Graphene Oxide is rather easy to make as well, using Graphite Flakes in a solution of sulfuric acid H2SO4, sodium nitrate NaNO3, and potassium permanganate KMnO4

#11 force_echo

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 01:52 PM

lol, then you obviously didn't watch the vid in post one...

All they did was take Graphene Oxide, squirt it onto a CD, and burn off the Oxide with a simple DVD Burner.

As I understand it, the Graphene Oxide is rather easy to make as well, using Graphite Flakes in a solution of sulfuric acid H2SO4, sodium nitrate NaNO3, and potassium permanganate KMnO4

Obviously you don't understand what I'm saying. Where do you get the Graphite Flakes? From your ass? Yeah, trust me, it takes a lot more than high school chemistry to make suitable Graphite Flakes for superconduction.

#12 force_echo

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 01:57 PM

And yet, it's theorized that the total global supply of Oil will run out within this century, with speculation placing it within a half century if use keeps growing.

I'm not sure on the yields of these Super Capacitors, but presumably they could probably match or beat current high energy batteries if I'm not mistaken.

And that is also more due to Lithium supplies for Lithium-Ion batteries needed to run these cars. Carbon however is everywhere, and all it takes is some highschool chemistry to produce Graphene Oxide, and with this new Method for producing flat sheets of pure Graphene in large quantities (rather then the previous method of Scotch Tape...) and you have an Abundant Supply of Energy Storage Devices for these cars.

I'm sure Horse breeders said the same thing back in the late 1800's

Speculated by who? There's no way the global oil supply will run out in this century.

Supercapacitors have nothing to do with voltage, or the overall juice of the battery.

It definitely takes a lot more than high school chemistry to make high grade graphite flakes. The process is timely, expensive, and not mass-producable.

They did. And thats why cars didn't catch on until after Ford, despite being functional for quite a while before then. Also, gas powered cars didn't have to worry about a cheaper, more efficient alternative.

#13 Skirmisher

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 09:35 PM

Speculated by who? There's no way the global oil supply will run out in this century.

Speculated by various economist and geological studies.

http://tceconomist.b...eft-really.html
States that Peak Oil use of our reserves will happen around 2045, after that, remaining oil reserves will be increasingly inefficient to extract.

http://www.greenbang...left_16795.html
States that sources such as Saudi Arabia (~20% of world oil reserves) only has a lifespan of 60 years, and that's being Generous. It goes on to say that The International Energy Agency presumes that the so called Peak Oil period is either soon on us, or is already happening.

I've also read in various sources which point to our development of renewable energy sources will elevate the strain on Oil reserves, and draw it out longer.

Other sources seem to think that Oil is inexhaustible for some reason... I didn't give them much credit though, nor much more then a glance.

Sensible thing is though, if we keep using oil at this growth rate, barring any new Super Finds, or Miracle technology which will allow us to extract far more oil then we already can. Estimates for how long we can keep on pumping are average at about 50 years before prices Really start to skyrocket. After that, if we haven't switched out to something else then the world economy is likely to collapse.


Supercapacitors have nothing to do with voltage, or the overall juice of the battery.

Um... what? Voltage is only one part of Power. I'm talking about Watts, which is the unit of Electrical Power. Please learn the difference.


It definitely takes a lot more than high school chemistry to make high grade graphite flakes. The process is timely, expensive, and not mass-producable.

http://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog/product/aldrich/332461?lang=en&region=CA

Um... I can buy 2.5kg for $60...

You don't really need High Grade graphite flakes to work this... it's all getting dissolved anyway.


They did. And thats why cars didn't catch on until after Ford, despite being functional for quite a while before then. Also, gas powered cars didn't have to worry about a cheaper, more efficient alternative.

Actually they did... when Ford was drawing up the plans for his first cars, he had the choice. Electric or Gasoline. At the time, Gas was too costly to produce, until I think an Irishman invented a method to "Crack" the oil to produce Gasoline more cheaply. So, the choice was clear, go with Gas.

#14 KidStranglehold

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 09:39 PM

Interesting video.

#15 force_echo

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 11:44 PM

Speculated by various economist and geological studies.

http://tceconomist.b...eft-really.html
States that Peak Oil use of our reserves will happen around 2045, after that, remaining oil reserves will be increasingly inefficient to extract.

http://www.greenbang...left_16795.html
States that sources such as Saudi Arabia (~20% of world oil reserves) only has a lifespan of 60 years, and that's being Generous. It goes on to say that The International Energy Agency presumes that the so called Peak Oil period is either soon on us, or is already happening.

I've also read in various sources which point to our development of renewable energy sources will elevate the strain on Oil reserves, and draw it out longer.

Other sources seem to think that Oil is inexhaustible for some reason... I didn't give them much credit though, nor much more then a glance.

Sensible thing is though, if we keep using oil at this growth rate, barring any new Super Finds, or Miracle technology which will allow us to extract far more oil then we already can. Estimates for how long we can keep on pumping are average at about 50 years before prices Really start to skyrocket. After that, if we haven't switched out to something else then the world economy is likely to collapse.



Um... what? Voltage is only one part of Power. I'm talking about Watts, which is the unit of Electrical Power. Please learn the difference.



http://www.sigmaaldr...ng=en&region=CA

Um... I can buy 2.5kg for $60...

You don't really need High Grade graphite flakes to work this... it's all getting dissolved anyway.



Actually they did... when Ford was drawing up the plans for his first cars, he had the choice. Electric or Gasoline. At the time, Gas was too costly to produce, until I think an Irishman invented a method to "Crack" the oil to produce Gasoline more cheaply. So, the choice was clear, go with Gas.

Neither of those sources say definitively that oil is going to run out within the century. Also, those people who say the global supply is inexhaustible, those are top economists. You might actually want to read the theory, it says that by the time oil's close to empty, a viable alternative will be used, an economically sound theory, something to take into mind the next time you hear something a little wild and immediately dismiss it.

This is hilarious. First of all, that's not my point at all. It doesn't matter how good of a capacitor you have, it's not going to change the juice of a battery. A 1.5V battery is going to be a 1.5V battery regardless. Please learn basic electric parts, i.e, the difference between a battery and a capacitor. Also, in regards to me using "volts" people use volts instead of amps to describe commercial batteries for a reason. The number of amps can be manipulated, the Voltage is the amount of electric potential energy, the amount of juice is constant.

To build a super-capacitor you would need high grade graphene flakes, i.e, flakes that are close to being only one atom thick. That's to improve the capacitance, the thinner the graphene is the less the electrons are going to disperse in the z plane. the notion that the graphene is going to be dissolved anyway doesn't make any sense. Why would you use graphene in the first place? All it is is carbon, if it's being dissolved, you could use carbon.

Which doesn't disprove my point whatsoever. So gasoline was the cheaper alternative after cracking was invented, which illustrates my point. Electric cars are still a lot more expensive than gasoline cars.

#16 Skirmisher

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 12:26 PM

Neither of those sources say definitively that oil is going to run out within the century. Also, those people who say the global supply is inexhaustible, those are top economists. You might actually want to read the theory, it says that by the time oil's close to empty, a viable alternative will be used, an economically sound theory, something to take into mind the next time you hear something a little wild and immediately dismiss it.

Oh? Would a Viable Alternative be better electrical storage mediums? Hmm, I believe there's a Super Capacitor that they're developing that would do just that.


This is hilarious. First of all, that's not my point at all. It doesn't matter how good of a capacitor you have, it's not going to change the juice of a battery. A 1.5V battery is going to be a 1.5V battery regardless. Please learn basic electric parts, i.e, the difference between a battery and a capacitor. Also, in regards to me using "volts" people use volts instead of amps to describe commercial batteries for a reason. The number of amps can be manipulated, the Voltage is the amount of electric potential energy, the amount of juice is constant.

No, you're wrong on such a simple fact. Electrical Storage Mediums, such as a Battery can be manipulated to provide whatever amount of volts or amps that is required of it. The "Juice" of a battery, ie How long it lasts, is the Watts. How much Power can it provide before it's supply is exhausted, is the amount of Work it can provide before requiring a recharge. The Amount of Work that an electrical storage medium can do is called Watts.

In fact you seem to be missing the basic reasoning of the Super Capacitor. That it charges as fast as a Capacitor, but expends that charge like a Battery.


To build a super-capacitor you would need high grade graphene flakes, i.e, flakes that are close to being only one atom thick. That's to improve the capacitance, the thinner the graphene is the less the electrons are going to disperse in the z plane. the notion that the graphene is going to be dissolved anyway doesn't make any sense. Why would you use graphene in the first place? All it is is carbon, if it's being dissolved, you could use carbon.

Um... yes, Graphene is Carbon... that's why it's being used. Please though, tell me where we could get another source of Carbon. Pure Carbon though, not bonded to hydrogen or something else.

As well... you seem to miss the point completely about using the Graphene to produce Graphene Oxide in a liquid form, in order to deploy it over a disc, which when spun and "burned" with a DVD laser, burns off the Oxide, leaving only a Super Thin layer of Graphene... That was the point.


Which doesn't disprove my point whatsoever. So gasoline was the cheaper alternative after cracking was invented, which illustrates my point. Electric cars are still a lot more expensive than gasoline cars.

At the time yes, but with all the price jumps over the last several decades, the only thing holding us onto gas is the time we've taken to make it more important to us. The Infrastructure, the economy, even our way of life.

The thing is though, that Electric Cars are only more Expensive because of the R&D that has to go into developing something that can compete with a technology that we've already mastered.

#17 force_echo

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 05:39 PM

Oh? Would a Viable Alternative be better electrical storage mediums? Hmm, I believe there's a Super Capacitor that they're developing that would do just that.



No, you're wrong on such a simple fact. Electrical Storage Mediums, such as a Battery can be manipulated to provide whatever amount of volts or amps that is required of it. The "Juice" of a battery, ie How long it lasts, is the Watts. How much Power can it provide before it's supply is exhausted, is the amount of Work it can provide before requiring a recharge. The Amount of Work that an electrical storage medium can do is called Watts.

In fact you seem to be missing the basic reasoning of the Super Capacitor. That it charges as fast as a Capacitor, but expends that charge like a Battery.



Um... yes, Graphene is Carbon... that's why it's being used. Please though, tell me where we could get another source of Carbon. Pure Carbon though, not bonded to hydrogen or something else.

As well... you seem to miss the point completely about using the Graphene to produce Graphene Oxide in a liquid form, in order to deploy it over a disc, which when spun and "burned" with a DVD laser, burns off the Oxide, leaving only a Super Thin layer of Graphene... That was the point.



At the time yes, but with all the price jumps over the last several decades, the only thing holding us onto gas is the time we've taken to make it more important to us. The Infrastructure, the economy, even our way of life.

The thing is though, that Electric Cars are only more Expensive because of the R&D that has to go into developing something that can compete with a technology that we've already mastered.

Except, like I've said before, that's not the only problem. Also, why do you capitalize completely random words?

Right, but voltage is used because it is the most constant measure, as opposed to watts, which changes like the circuit changes, depending on the load of the circuit, so like I already said, that's why I used Volts. The voltage is provided by the battery and current is drawn by the load. The magnitude of current (and therefore the power) depends on the load resistance. We cannot predict it. So, we just indicate the maximum voltage that the battery can supply (i.e) on an open circuit.

It doesn't really matter, because that's not the point. The point is that a capacitor doesn't affect the amount of power a battery puts out. If you have a standard battery that's 1.5V and you hook it up to the best capicator in existence, it's not going to last any longer, because a capacitor can only store and expend charge, that's its purpose.

Lol. Coal? Soot? Peat Moss? The air after it's been passed through a Limefication procedure? It's fairly easy to fabricate true amorphous carbon, and you don't even have to make it thin.

Except the Graphene has to be thin already, you have to use high grade graphene formed by CVD to make a true supercapicator, you can't just burn off the oxide and have dissolved carbon magically form into one-atom thick layers, it already has to be configured and thin. Besides, if it really were that easy, graphene based technologies would be pretty common in electrical devices by now. So it obviously isn't.

And the fact that electric cars are more expensive. And electric cars aren't more expensive because of R&D, they're more expensive because it's a more expensive technology as of now.

#18 Skirmisher

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 12:47 AM

Also, why do you capitalize completely random words?

Because i Can. why, Does It bother You when i Do that?


Right, but voltage is used because it is the most constant measure, as opposed to watts, which changes like the circuit changes, depending on the load of the circuit, so like I already said, that's why I used Volts. The voltage is provided by the battery and current is drawn by the load. The magnitude of current (and therefore the power) depends on the load resistance. We cannot predict it. So, we just indicate the maximum voltage that the battery can supply (i.e) on an open circuit.

Do you even understand how stupid you just sounded there? I mean... I learned Basic electrical shit in early highschool... I mean... hasn't anyone ever taught you Ohm's Law?

Posted Image

Voltage = Current x Resistance; Current = Voltage over Resistance; Resistance = Voltage over Current.


Resistance in a circuit, is usually the Load, or the object doing the work. Such as a Light Bulb, or an Electrical Motor. Normally this is expected to never change in a fixed system, such as say a Car. So, this would Fix the Resistance of the circuit to a known number.

The Power Source can also be adjusted, to provide a chosen amount of Voltage. There are 1.5V batteries, as well as 12V batteries, as well as a whole slue between and around that number.

You seem to be under the delusion that it Matters when considering the Lifespan of a power supply. In part, yes, it does matter, only not as much as you seem to figure.

Which is why I'm talking about Watts, the amount of stored Power within a medium. The amount of Work that a power supply can do before it's charge is depleted.

Here, let me dumb it down for you.

Voltage is the flow of a system, current is the strength of that flow, resistance is the impedance to that flow... but Power (Watts) is like the gas in the tank which fuels that system.

That's why the ones that know what they are talking about were talking about Wattage.


It doesn't really matter, because that's not the point. The point is that a capacitor doesn't affect the amount of power a battery puts out. If you have a standard battery that's 1.5V and you hook it up to the best capicator in existence, it's not going to last any longer, because a capacitor can only store and expend charge, that's its purpose.

Um, that's the whole point. The purpose of this Super Capacitor was that it takes a charge fast like a Capacitor, but expends it slowly like a battery. That way you wouldn't have to spend several hours charging your Electric Car. You could literally pull into a charging station, take as much time as you would gassing up a standard car, and then leave on your way with a full charge.


Lol. Coal? Soot? Peat Moss? The air after it's been passed through a Limefication procedure? It's fairly easy to fabricate true amorphous carbon, and you don't even have to make it thin.

Yes, but as you point out in the next quote you need a CVD to use that Amorphous Carbon. Without it you have essentially Carbon Crud.


Except the Graphene has to be thin already, you have to use high grade graphene formed by CVD to make a true supercapicator, you can't just burn off the oxide and have dissolved carbon magically form into one-atom thick layers, it already has to be configured and thin. Besides, if it really were that easy, graphene based technologies would be pretty common in electrical devices by now. So it obviously isn't.

Except They did it, as you would have seen in the video I started this whole thing off with... They didn't need a CVD, they just needed a CD, and a DVD burner.

They were trying to find an Easier method to produce super thin Graphene wafers, and they did. Not only that, but they were able to produce wafers thin enough to use in Super Capacitors.

As well, if you'd bothered to do any research on the subject, they're already using Graphene based technology in what I believe they're calling augmented Lithium-Ion Batteries.


quote name='force_echo' timestamp='1362008391' post='416193'
And the fact that electric cars are more expensive. And electric cars aren't more expensive because of R&D, they're more expensive because it's a more expensive technology as of now./quote


Yes, and the simple point which you seem unable to grasp, is that R&D such as work on Super Capacitors and the like, will make these cars far more Affordable to the public.

For instance, I skimmed though one of the leading car manufacturers website (I think it might have been Honda?) and they had a fully electric car on for only 1.5x to 2x the cost of a conventional car. Considering where electrical cars were half a decade ago, that's a great Leap in price. It also doesn't take into consideration the fact that with these new Super Capacitors, you won't need Expensive Lithium-Ion batteries, which would further drive the cost down.

Such is the result of R&D

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 11:58 AM

Because i Can. why, Does It bother You when i Do that?



Do you even understand how stupid you just sounded there? I mean... I learned Basic electrical shit in early highschool... I mean... hasn't anyone ever taught you Ohm's Law?

Posted Image

Voltage = Current x Resistance; Current = Voltage over Resistance; Resistance = Voltage over Current.


Resistance in a circuit, is usually the Load, or the object doing the work. Such as a Light Bulb, or an Electrical Motor. Normally this is expected to never change in a fixed system, such as say a Car. So, this would Fix the Resistance of the circuit to a known number.

The Power Source can also be adjusted, to provide a chosen amount of Voltage. There are 1.5V batteries, as well as 12V batteries, as well as a whole slue between and around that number.

You seem to be under the delusion that it Matters when considering the Lifespan of a power supply. In part, yes, it does matter, only not as much as you seem to figure.

Which is why I'm talking about Watts, the amount of stored Power within a medium. The amount of Work that a power supply can do before it's charge is depleted.

Here, let me dumb it down for you.

Voltage is the flow of a system, current is the strength of that flow, resistance is the impedance to that flow... but Power (Watts) is like the gas in the tank which fuels that system.

That's why the ones that know what they are talking about were talking about Wattage.



Um, that's the whole point. The purpose of this Super Capacitor was that it takes a charge fast like a Capacitor, but expends it slowly like a battery. That way you wouldn't have to spend several hours charging your Electric Car. You could literally pull into a charging station, take as much time as you would gassing up a standard car, and then leave on your way with a full charge.



Yes, but as you point out in the next quote you need a CVD to use that Amorphous Carbon. Without it you have essentially Carbon Crud.



Except They did it, as you would have seen in the video I started this whole thing off with... They didn't need a CVD, they just needed a CD, and a DVD burner.

They were trying to find an Easier method to produce super thin Graphene wafers, and they did. Not only that, but they were able to produce wafers thin enough to use in Super Capacitors.

As well, if you'd bothered to do any research on the subject, they're already using Graphene based technology in what I believe they're calling augmented Lithium-Ion Batteries.


quote name='force_echo' timestamp='1362008391' post='416193'
And the fact that electric cars are more expensive. And electric cars aren't more expensive because of R&D, they're more expensive because it's a more expensive technology as of now./quote


Yes, and the simple point which you seem unable to grasp, is that R&D such as work on Super Capacitors and the like, will make these cars far more Affordable to the public.

For instance, I skimmed though one of the leading car manufacturers website (I think it might have been Honda?) and they had a fully electric car on for only 1.5x to 2x the cost of a conventional car. Considering where electrical cars were half a decade ago, that's a great Leap in price. It also doesn't take into consideration the fact that with these new Super Capacitors, you won't need Expensive Lithium-Ion batteries, which would further drive the cost down.

Such is the result of R&D

Not really, it's just weird and unnecessary.

What? In one circuit, the voltage never changes, maybe a little around the terminals, but 1.5V is going to be 1.5V and 12V is going to be 12V, again, if I wasn't right, then why aren't batteries measured in Watts? Are you smarter than every electrical engineer in existence? Hey guys, guess what, some random dude in Canada is apparently so ingenious, he figured out that every single battery on the planet should change how it's measured, with his EXTENSIVE knowledge in electrical engineering. Also, the fact that you said the resistance never changes is so stupid, it pretty much invalidates every freaking circuit related claim you ever make. Are you serious? The load changes constantly, capacitors change load. Open up a circuit. You see all those round things in there? EVERY ONE OF THOSE changes the load of the circuit at different points. In a car, if you change speed, the load will change, if you brake, load changes, if you turn, load changes, in a smartphone, every time you touch the damn screen, the load changes. You know what doesn't? The Voltage. That's why we use Voltage. Do YOU know Ohm's law? If the Ampere changes, then the Power changes, but the Voltage is consistent. You should read over what I said, let it sink in, and when you finally understand it, come back without sounding like a retard.

Can you even understand what I'm saying? I'm not talking about how long it takes to charge, I'm talking about how long it go off on charge, which won't change no matter how awesome of a capacitor you have. If you have a tank, and have a really big water bucket, and you can dump that water bucket all at once, does it change the amount of water you have? (The answer is no, by the way).

Lolwut? Now you're changing your mind? You said that it doesn't matter if Graphene is thin or not, because it gets dissolved anyway. The hard part is making it thin, so amorphous carbon would be infinitely easier to use. If the Graphene is just dissolved, like you said, then why not use amorphous carbon? Here's the answer, because the Graphene NEEDS to be configured thin. Again, the Graphene has to be configured a certain way, and that's the expensive part.

Except you would need the expensive Lithium Ion batteries, because the Capacitor wouldn't change the amount of juice the battery had, which is my point, which you seem to be unable to grasp. Electric cars are still a more expensive alternative.




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