Jump to content


Photo
* * * - - 3 votes

DBZ feats! For those unaware.

DBZ

  • Please log in to reply
196 replies to this topic

#61 force_echo

force_echo

    Pretentious, Obnoxious, Annoying...humanity's last hope

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,750 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Charlotte, NC
  • Interests:Anything Interesting

Posted 02 July 2012 - 01:13 PM

General relativity applies to velocity calculated locally. When you have the space in between two objects expanding, both objects are moving away from each other, causing a phenomenon called co-moving distance. That's why the galaxies are moving away at speeds above c.

#62 silversurfer092

silversurfer092

    Yeezus

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,631 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 02 July 2012 - 01:39 PM

Well so far everything still falls under Einstein's rule or law of relatively. That the cosmic speed limit is up to light speed. Everything else is theoretical and just theories

Only worm holes allow faster than light and so far we cannot prove it


I think, to be technical, nothing in a vacuum moves faster than light. I'm pretty sure they just discovered a molecule that travels faster than light in a vacuum though, so Einstein's rule might be dunzos.

#63 I_KNOW_ALL

I_KNOW_ALL

    The lovechild of Master Roshi and Majin Buu.

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,258 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Nochas!
  • Interests:Figgin Anime!, Gaming, and Music.

Posted 02 July 2012 - 02:54 PM

Please guys take your discussion elsewhere if it's not related to the topic.

#64 Dr. Pymp(mex)

Dr. Pymp(mex)

    Believes Han shot first

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,988 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Earth

Posted 02 July 2012 - 04:27 PM




To show that they use their telepathy to fight via astral plane

#65 Hayesmeister5651

Hayesmeister5651

    That guy with poo brains

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,047 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Batcave
  • Interests:Things

Posted 02 July 2012 - 04:31 PM

Heh, I forgot about that scene.

When Goku gets to Namek he reads Krillin's mind. He didn't even know if he could or not, he tried it and it worked.

#66 Dr. Pymp(mex)

Dr. Pymp(mex)

    Believes Han shot first

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,988 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Earth

Posted 02 July 2012 - 09:30 PM

Yeah on my time off I did some searching for this for this topic, yeah the part you say is what I mean about them doing anything by trying and training for it. Goku did it w/o anyone teaching him which will show if he was being mindwiped he could potentially learn to resist or defend vs it based on how powerful someone is, maybe?

#67 Hayesmeister5651

Hayesmeister5651

    That guy with poo brains

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,047 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Batcave
  • Interests:Things

Posted 02 July 2012 - 11:19 PM

Yeah on my time off I did some searching for this for this topic, yeah the part you say is what I mean about them doing anything by trying and training for it. Goku did it w/o anyone teaching him which will show if he was being mind wiped he could potentially learn to resist or defend vs it based on how powerful someone is, maybe?

I wouldn't say they can learn anything. We only know what they can learn by what is evident in the series. EDIT: Although Kid Buu learned instant transmission just by watching Goku do it. He could possibly be an exception due to his magical origins.

As far as resisting telepathic assaults, I think they could. In Marvel and DC it seems if you have a strong will power, you can resist such attacks. Goku is too pure and too focused to be mind f*cked. Vegeta's pride would probably fend off most attacks.

Someone like Darkseid could mind f*ck them hard though. Martian Manhunter is a very powerful telepath, and he could only keep Joker sane for a few moments. So, it seems as long as you are strong minded, you can resist mind attacks.

#68 sirmethos

sirmethos

    A Man of the People

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,142 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 02 July 2012 - 11:36 PM

Having a strong will, will only let you resist certain kinds of telepathy. A mind blast(like what Xavier used against Magneto, leaving him a vegetable) will have full effect, regardless of how strong your will is, the only way to defend against direct attacks like that, is to have telepathic defenses, more powerful than the person attacking you. Mind Control, illusions, etc. the more subtle methods of telepathic attacks, can be resisted by pure will power.

Basically, you just look at the effects. Is the telepath doing something that has to stay in place for a long time(mind control, illusions, rearranging memories, etc.), then it can be resisted by will power. Is the telepath doing an attack that simply has a 'here and now' effect(mind blast, telepathic spike, etc.) then no amount of will power will protect you.

#69 Dr. Pymp(mex)

Dr. Pymp(mex)

    Believes Han shot first

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,988 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Earth

Posted 03 July 2012 - 12:51 AM

I meant anything that could be seen as a technique. Just saying that based on what is shown if Goku learned telepathy on a whim he could learn to counter just as easily.

Sirmethos you are right in the sense that Prof X an others can use telepathy on a wider range inducing many different kinds of attacks but if mind control is out, they have a great shot at taking hits from mind wipes or even basic mind reading. Good example is Hulk, no matter what Prof X does he can't see his mind or even begin to do damage. Hulk has no telepathic defense what so ever and then you have Goku that called Vegeta out for letting someone do it to him, that and the fact that Goku can and has learned techniques that others can't making this plausible. I mean if Magneto can resist it why not someone much more powerful in mind.

#70 sirmethos

sirmethos

    A Man of the People

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,142 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 03 July 2012 - 01:59 AM

I'll just address the few points that you have completely wrong.

"Just saying that based on what is shown if Goku learned telepathy on a whim he could learn to counter just as easily."

Not quite, there is quite a difference between reading someone's mind(something that pretty much even the weakest telepath with active powers can do), and creating active telepathic shields, especially powerful ones(something that takes skill and training, even for the most powerful telepaths).

Also, even if Goku could learn to create Telepathic shields, by the time in a match, that someone has mind blasted him, or taken him down with a telepathic spike, it would be too late.

To give you an analogy, the 'slower' more subtle telepathic attacks(mind control, illusions, mind alteration, etc.), is like throwing a net over someone's mind. If they have a strong enough will, they can break out of the net. The 'instant', more direct telepathic attacks(mind blast, telepathic spike, etc.), are like firing a bullet from a gun. Once it hits, it's too late to do anything about it. And you can't 'resist' it, either you block it, or it hits you.


"Good example is Hulk, no matter what Prof X does he can't see his mind or even begin to do damage."

That's not entirely correct. In the comics, they have, IIRC, never tried something like a mind blast/telepathic spike/etc. to just plain shut Hulk's brain down, or instantly mind wipe him. What they generally try is entering his mind, to telepathically calm his rage, or put telepathic 'shields' around the Hulk persona, so that Banner keeps his mind and the Hulk persona doesn't get out. And all of those fail, for several reasons. 1. Rage, Hulk's will power is extremely strong, and due to his rage, he instantly fights any telepathic intrusion with everything he's got. And considering Hulk's general level of rage when they try things like that, that's quite a lot. 2. Multiple personalities. Unlike a 'sane' mind, Hulk/Banner actually has several personalities inside his mind, and a telepath that tries one of the more subtle methods(which is what they, for some reason, always try with Hulk), then they have to fight not just one mind, but several minds at the same time.

Jean Grey(at the fight with Onslaught) showed that it is very much possible to enter, and affect, Hulk's mind when he is calm.


"Hulk has no telepathic defense what so ever"

Not quite true. Multiple Personalities is just as effective, if not more so, than telepathic shields, when dealing with the more 'subtle' methods of Telepathic attacks. And as I mentioned above, they've never actually(IIRC) tried the more 'direct' telepathic attacks. Primarily because of Banner.


"I mean if Magneto can resist it why not someone much more powerful in mind."

Two things with this

1. Magneto probably has one of the strongest, non-telepath, minds on earth.
2. Magneto's powers helps him shield his mind. Even without his helmet, he has extremely powerful mental shields.

#71 Dr. Pymp(mex)

Dr. Pymp(mex)

    Believes Han shot first

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,988 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Earth

Posted 03 July 2012 - 08:35 AM

So hulks rage helps him from being effected, and Goku does what when he turns SsJ? He goes into a rage and screams, so if anything Goku's rage is just as powerful.

In Onslaught, Jean entered Hulk's mind but she was allowed by Hulk, not if Hulk resisted, and no mind wipe and other forms of telepathy will not work on him, the whole multiple personality for hulk is correct but not for that being the reason that he has defenses for telepathy

#72 sirmethos

sirmethos

    A Man of the People

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,142 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 03 July 2012 - 12:22 PM

1. Goku only goes into a rage when he transforms to SS at the beginning, after Cell, he doesn't do that anymore.

2. Goku's rage being just as powerful as Hulk's? Possible, but I highly doubt it.

3. We don't know if the more direct forms of telepathy would work on Hulk, since no one has ever actually tried.

and 4. Yes, having multiple personalities is a large part of why the more subtle forms of telepathic intrusion doesn't work on Hulk.

#73 Buzz Line

Buzz Line

    I like it on Omicron Ceti III, Jim

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 490 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:An access poit.
  • Interests:The behavior and habitat of fauna. History. Cultures. Fiction?

Posted 03 July 2012 - 05:43 PM

I haven't been on a while, but I'd just like to put this up. Thirty seconds is all that anyone needs to watch. Only Thirty Seconds.

Watch that and tell me why people say Brolly is "weaker" than Cell or "Super" Seventeen. Cell boasted about being able to blow away the sun(and didn't do it) Broly destroyed the south galaxy and didn't think anything of it.

#74 bigballerju

bigballerju

    The Last Son of Krypton

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,316 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Hollywood, Florida
  • Interests:Sports, Women, Comics, Games, Music, Clubs, Movies, and more.

Posted 03 July 2012 - 06:10 PM

Broly got defeated by beings far weaker then him. Buu was able to fight Vegeto and Gotenks. Super 17 fought SS4 Goku. Broly got beat in the first movie by Goku who absorbed the energies of 3 weak fighters who were barely alive. In the second Adult Gohen who wasn't as powerful as he should have been was able to fight Broly. Broly couldn't overpower Goku, Gohan, and Goten.

#75 Darxeth

Darxeth

    Nuking the site from orbit

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,500 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Raccoon City

Posted 03 July 2012 - 07:50 PM

The problem with DBZ is that the character feats are highly inconsistent.

#76 Buzz Line

Buzz Line

    I like it on Omicron Ceti III, Jim

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 490 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:An access poit.
  • Interests:The behavior and habitat of fauna. History. Cultures. Fiction?

Posted 03 July 2012 - 08:19 PM

Personally, I don't consider GT legit but... Super Saiyan Four Goku didn't impress me when he was disabled by ice. Back when Goku trained in the outer reaches of the time chamber where the ice was forming faster than his aura could break it, he kept going. Up until Omega Shenron none of their power levels even seem close to Cell level, like it wasn't until the end Toei remembered these guys blow up planets through careless poweruse.

Since the movies aren't part of the regualr series plots, I think that Buu beating stronger fighters means that the movie versions of Goku and friends are stronger than the regular series, the movie just interpreted their power levels a different way or that the writers didn't have a good grasp on the concept of consistency. Regardless, it is not until Buu that we even have a non-movie character confirmed to destory a star. Buu destroyed a galaxies but did so off panel. For all we knew he spent a billion years destroying each star one at a time while he warred with the Kais.

And in Brolly's second appearance, which would be between Cell and Buu, he's able to overpower Goku and his two son's combined special attack at the same time until Trunks steps in, I'd say at the very least he's much stronger than Cell. Even if Gohan, who beat Cell by himself, had been "slacking off" Goku spent all those years training.

Maybe Brolly should be considered "weak" to later Dragon Ball characters, but his first on screen feat taken on its own puts him slightly below the likes of Marvel's Odin. If one simply read the Dragon Ball comic without ever watching the movies one probably wouldn't get the impression Goku ever had that kind of power, at least not until the Buu series, if you're really generous.

Vegito maybe, he powered through Super Buu's attack that was tearing at the seems of reality, I could buy him duplicating the feats in the films, but not Goku. Hatchyack is Brolly's equal, Janemba would be stronger than Broly by definition, and so would Gogeta but they're also movie only characters. In future Z discussions there should be a disclaimer to leave out movie feats unless using movie characters because I feel like Toei really let themselves go when making them and further that, just because a movie character beat weaker versions of the Z cast shouldn't mean they should be considered weak when fighting characters from other franchises on the CBUB(Brolly's record kind of speaks for itself).

Watching GT, I got the impression these guys were weaker than Cell, up until Nova Shenron was stated to have power that burned hotter than the sun. That was litterally the first time Super Saiyan Four Goku looked strong, when fighting him and then Goku's crippled by a little ice, less than he had to deal with at the start of the series when we were on Android Number eight. In that case it seems like Toei went too far in the opposite direction.

Since this thread seems to be doing feats in order, you missed Arale and Android #8's feats of strength by the way. The former head butted General Blue(the same Blue Tao killed) from China to Egypt and the latter knocked General white over the horizon.

#77 Hayesmeister5651

Hayesmeister5651

    That guy with poo brains

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,047 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Batcave
  • Interests:Things

Posted 04 July 2012 - 02:34 PM

Broly couldn't overpower Goku, Gohan, and Goten.

That is incorrect. He was over powering them, he only lost because Trunks interfered. He was tanking three planet busting attacks like it was nothing.

#78 bigballerju

bigballerju

    The Last Son of Krypton

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,316 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Hollywood, Florida
  • Interests:Sports, Women, Comics, Games, Music, Clubs, Movies, and more.

Posted 04 July 2012 - 02:42 PM

Trunk's small blast shouldn't even have bothered him. Also if Broly was as powerful as he was suppose to be he still should have overpowered them even after Trunks interfered. Broly before and after Trunks had enough time to completely destroy them.

#79 Hayesmeister5651

Hayesmeister5651

    That guy with poo brains

  • CBUB Match Judges
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,047 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Batcave
  • Interests:Things

Posted 04 July 2012 - 02:55 PM

Trunk's small blast shouldn't even have bothered him. Also if Broly was as powerful as he was suppose to be he still should have overpowered them even after Trunks interfered. Broly before and after Trunks had enough time to completely destroy them.

Nah, the blast had a huge impact on the outcome. Attacks like the Kamehameha stream from the users' hands. Broly's attacks leave his hand, so when the one hit Trunks' blast, none of his other attacks were hitting the Kamehameha. Don't forget that it is a movie. The villains have an hour or so to make their appearance and die. Where as other villains have entire sagas. That is why movie villains die in stupid ways.

#80 Ruinus

Ruinus

    Plebiscite Moderator

  • Moderators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,154 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:SupaFreedomland AKA USA
  • Interests:Star Wars, Guilty Gear, Guns N' Roses, astronomy, school, English, reading, science fiction, drawing, video games and playing guitar.

Posted 04 July 2012 - 09:30 PM

Pretty sure that Broly "destroying the South Galaxy" stuff is bullshit, what with part of the movie taking place on a planet in the South Galaxy.





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: DBZ

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users