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The Joker VS Deathstroke


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#41 sirmethos

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 04:21 AM

How was it PIS? The guy planned the whole thing out and executed it like the hardcore villain that he is.

He used all their obvious weaknesses and the only real PIS, is that Deathstroke lost.



To quote what I said about Deathstroke's fight being PIS, vs. Prometheus' fight being considered 'real', in another thread:

From what I've seen here on CBUB, and what I know of the two characters, the like/dislike comes from the fact that a lot of people don't understand Deathstroke's power(s), while Prometheus is a late 90's creation, and following the 90's trend is an 'easy to access badass'.

If you don't understand Deathstroke's power(s), then he's essentially just a normal human with slight enhancements, and from that perspective(however wrong it may be) he's nothing special, he definitely shouldn't stand a chance against any super-powered group of JLA members.


While with Prometheus, everything about his 'power(s)' is explained and easily understood, with equipment that directly targets specific weaknesses of some of the more powerful JLA members. It's easy to see how he could defeat a group of super-powered JLA members.



Hope that explains it for you.

#42 Marvel Man

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 05:50 AM

Yo, Bigballerju, that was rookie Kyle. The kid had just seen his teammates get owned by Deathstroke, cut him some slack.

Hope that explains it for you.

Wait, what? That made absolutely no sense. Are you taking away from Deathstroke's hardcoreness because he's not Prometheus (who is also quite skilled)? Because he doesn't have massive superpowers or a computer in his head? That makes no sense Methos. His mind is his superpower.

And yes, being a bad@$$ was made easy in the 90s, but that doesn't matter. In fact, that should take away from Prometheus. Deathstroke was bad@$$ before being bad@$$ was cool.

And I guesss all of Batman's fights are PIS as well, since he doesn't have any powers either.

#43 God-Speed_88

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 07:41 AM

I agree with Marvel Man, Deathstroke has an insane level of skill and is a master tactician. He is badass, his fights are Canon. No one can take that away from him.

#44 thanosisawesome

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 07:54 AM

Deathstroke has more training and experience then Batman. Deathstroke been around since WWII in DC Comics. Batman only beat Deathstroke once during Crisis and he had help from his apprentices.


Wrong. Batman has beaten Deathstroke alone. Also, Batman is more skilled.

#45 thanosisawesome

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 07:55 AM

Green Lantern going for a punch instead of using constructs or many of the other ring's abilities is one of the stupidest things I have seen. I am sorry even I have to say thats a huge ass PIS.

The only Green Lantern who would be dumb enough to do that is Hal.


Exactly.

#46 thanosisawesome

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 07:57 AM

Yo, Bigballerju, that was rookie Kyle. The kid had just seen his teammates get owned by Deathstroke, cut him some slack.


Wait, what? That made absolutely no sense. Are you taking away from Deathstroke's hardcoreness because he's not Prometheus (who is also quite skilled)? Because he doesn't have massive superpowers or a computer in his head? That makes no sense Methos. His mind is his superpower.

And yes, being a bad@$$ was made easy in the 90s, but that doesn't matter. In fact, that should take away from Prometheus. Deathstroke was bad@$$ before being bad@$$ was cool.

And I guesss all of Batman's fights are PIS as well, since he doesn't have any powers either.


Actually, Batman's fights are not PIS. Deathstrokes fight was PIS because the heroes virtually helped Deathstroke win.

#47 God-Speed_88

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 08:02 AM

Actually, Batman's fights are not PIS. Deathstrokes fight was PIS because the heroes virtually helped Deathstroke win.


Remember Deathstroke planned the battle down to the smallest detail. Everything was prepared.

Kyle was a rookie, he had just started, him throwing a punch was stupid, but not absurd.

#48 SSGoku

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 08:45 AM

You know, I've been thinking about it, and I decided te fight did have a bit of PIS, mostly being that each JLA member just sorta stood around and watched as there friends were beaten, and just waited for there turn to die.

#49 Hayesmeister5651

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 09:18 AM

Wait, what? That made absolutely no sense. Are you taking away from Deathstroke's hardcoreness because he's not Prometheus (who is also quite skilled)? Because he doesn't have massive superpowers or a computer in his head? That makes no sense Methos. His mind is his superpower.

And yes, being a bad@$$ was made easy in the 90s, but that doesn't matter. In fact, that should take away from Prometheus. Deathstroke was bad@$$ before being bad@$$ was cool.

And I guesss all of Batman's fights are PIS as well, since he doesn't have any powers either.

That's not what he means.

Prometheus' powers are basically spelled out, that is why people don't have a problem with him smashing the JLA.

Deathstroke's 90% brain power is not spelled out, and it requires you to think what you can do with that much brain power. That is why people (the ones who can't think) have a problem with a Wolverine level character(Slade) taking out the JLA.

#50 Scar

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 10:40 AM

Deathstroke takes this easily. Joker is only still alive today because Batman is able to withstand the urge he has to kill him. That and Superman and Gordon being around the times that Batman did snap and almost killed him. Deathstroke on the other hand, can actually hold his own in a straight up fight with his enemies.

As for Deathstroke beating the Justice League, I find it hilarious that he has evolved from a guy I remember being beaten by a one shot villain with a sword in his own comic, to being able to defeat the Justice League. But then if one thing can be said about comics, it's that they're inconsistent at times.

#51 sirmethos

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 11:16 AM

Yo, Bigballerju, that was rookie Kyle. The kid had just seen his teammates get owned by Deathstroke, cut him some slack.


Wait, what? That made absolutely no sense. Are you taking away from Deathstroke's hardcoreness because he's not Prometheus (who is also quite skilled)? Because he doesn't have massive superpowers or a computer in his head? That makes no sense Methos. His mind is his superpower.

And yes, being a bad@$$ was made easy in the 90s, but that doesn't matter. In fact, that should take away from Prometheus. Deathstroke was bad@$$ before being bad@$$ was cool.

And I guesss all of Batman's fights are PIS as well, since he doesn't have any powers either.


Wow, it's been a long time since I've seen anyone misunderstand one of my posts that badly.

I completely agree that Deathstroke is one of the most hardcore street level characters, if you try looking at various matches, you'll see me as one of the few debating on the side of Deathstroke against pretty much anyone that isn't super powered.


The reason that Deathstroke's fight against JLA is considered PIS by a lot of people is, as I explained in the quoted post, because people don't understand his power(s).

If you don't understand his power(s), then what you see is basically just a slightly augmented human. And from that perspective(however wrong it is), the JLA fight makes no sense. Hence, PIS.


Prometheus' power(s) are simple, explained and easily understood. People have no problem understanding his power(s), thus people accept his victory over the JLA.


I hope this, slightly, more simplified explanation clears things up for you.(didn't think Marvel Man was ever gonna be one of the people I'd have to explain something in simple terms for...)

#52 SSGoku

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 11:32 AM

Deathstroke takes this easily. Joker is only still alive today because Batman is able to withstand the urge he has to kill him. That and Superman and Gordon being around the times that Batman did snap and almost killed him. Deathstroke on the other hand, can actually hold his own in a straight up fight with his enemies.

As for Deathstroke beating the Justice League, I find it hilarious that he has evolved from a guy I remember being beaten by a one shot villain with a sword in his own comic, to being able to defeat the Justice League. But then if one thing can be said about comics, it's that they're inconsistent at times.

But on the flip side, if Joker were ever serious, and I mean REALLY serious, like when the laughter stops serious, if he were ever THAT serious, IMO even Batman himself would lose.

#53 OMFG

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 11:36 AM

But on the flip side, if Joker were ever serious, and I mean REALLY serious, like when the laughter stops serious, if he were ever THAT serious, IMO even Batman himself would lose.

Why do you over-estimate Joker so much?
Sure he can murder multiple people, but so what?
The " Evilest " thing he has done to the Bat Family is, Killed Jason Todd and his Mom ( The Fan's Chose That ) and Shot Oracle In The Spine.

#54 Hayesmeister5651

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 11:42 AM

Why do you over-estimate Joker so much?
Sure he can murder multiple people, but so what?
The " Evilest " thing he has done to the Bat Family is, Killed Jason Todd and his Mom ( The Fan's Chose That ) and Shot Oracle In The Spine.

uuhhh and he kidnapped Gordon, got him naked, hosed him off, beat the shit out of him, showed him pictures of his daughter in agony, all for the sake of trying to make Gordon go crazy.

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 11:53 AM

uuhhh and he kidnapped Gordon, got him naked, hosed him off, beat the shit out of him, showed him pictures of his daughter in agony, all for the sake of trying to make Gordon go crazy.

And that two.

#56 SSGoku

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 11:58 AM

Why do you over-estimate Joker so much?

Why do you overestimate Deathstroke so much?

#57 OMFG

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 12:01 PM

Why do you overestimate Deathstroke so much?

I don't.
I just know he is capable of beating a Lunatic with no past experience.
I mean, what was he a lowly criminal that fell into Radioactive Waste?
What can he do to hurt Deathstroke? So it's a war, I'm sure that hired guns and a couple of goons would be no problem with Deathstroke.
Now how Joker handle a couple of Hired Guns?

#58 Hayesmeister5651

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 12:37 PM

I don't.
I just know he is capable of beating a Lunatic with no past experience.
I mean, what was he a lowly criminal that fell into Radioactive Waste?
What can he do to hurt Deathstroke? So it's a war, I'm sure that hired guns and a couple of goons would be no problem with Deathstroke.
Now how Joker handle a couple of Hired Guns?

thing is, Deatshtroke has tried and failed to kill Joker

#59 AVP vs The Terminator

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 12:40 PM

thing is, Deatshtroke has tried and failed to kill Joker

It only happened once; it was more than likely a fluke. Also, Deathstroke will have learned from his mistakes there.

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Posted 19 August 2011 - 12:53 PM

It only happened once; it was more than likely a fluke. Also, Deathstroke will have learned from his mistakes there.

This is the only one of Joker Vs DS

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