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Zombies vs U.S. forces


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#41 Jason Redfield

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:09 PM

Jason: Witches WILL get involved if you startle them. Gunshots, and those from a larger group of people, could and possibly will startle those in a further distance and cause them to attack the source of noise, which would be the soldiers. However... Witches can and will kill zombies and whatnot if they were startled by them. Besides all that, not many are seen in the day time, only a few. A large number of them are seen at night time and they actually gather in areas that have the scent of sugar in the air, such as a sugar cane field or a sugar manufacturing plant. As such, I doubt the witches will be an issue pertaining to these circumstances.


Well, yes, they can be startled. But you pretty much expanded on my point yourself.

#42 Jaeger Panzer

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:13 PM

Yeah, no problem.

#43 Marvel Man

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:28 PM

In my opinion, zombies are the awesomest horror characters. Vampires died with Twilight, while Frankenstein isn't really evil at all. Ghosts and demons are scary and what not, but easily defeated under the right circumstances. Werewolves have too many glaring weaknesses. Etc.

Zombies on the other hand. Man, they could take out the world.

Having said that, up against a trained military, the zombies have no chance. I don't have the time or patience to wade through all these posts, but even without copters or tanks, the army takes it. I don't care how smart you are, or how much you don't feel pain, if your limbs get shot off you, you will go down. Heck, I realize only a bullet to the head truly kills a zombie, but just spraying the area with bullets should reduce the mob of zombies to disabled monsters who can only pull themselves at slow speed, and growl menacingly.

Seriously, this is an untrained mob, who's only attack is hand to hand biting/scratching.

Plus, if movies are any indication of things, we just need some lone hero to hole himself up and start taking out zombies (Zombieland anyone?) Military ftw.

#44 Ruinus

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:57 PM

Runinus, here are some feats for the Troxin Zombies.

1: One took getting blasted in the face, with steam, metling the skin off its face. This same zombie got shot in half by a shotgun. Also the LFD zombies and the Trioxion zombies can run...and with this advantage, they can like wait until the soliders HAVE to stop to reload.

2: One zombie took a police radio, and called in more cops, who they then swarmed.

3: One was smart enough to try and pry the doors, that a girl had locked, right off the hinges.


None of that matters.

Why?

Because of a little conflict known as World War I, where millions of human beings armed with rifles and guns and wearing protective gear tried rushing entrenched military positions in large numbers.
They failed spectacularly, and afterwards mass-charges went out of military strategy books, never to return.

The zombies have none of the advantages the WWI soldiers did. No covering fire, no artillery support, no speed, and only some of them are actually smart. They'll die faster than a poor WWI who died to gain a few yards for his country.

They would probably attack the civillans/police officers/ SWAT officers, who are probably not as well armed as the Soliders. And by not well armed, I mean by like the civillans probably aren't gonna be stealing guns off the soliders/ and the officers while they are fighting the zombies.


There are less police officers than soldiers. Even a single soldier armed with a machine gun and accompanied with a soldier to load and change ammo can sit and kill tens of zombies running at him all day. Hundreds.

Now I got a question. For the defenses that I put up for each of the battles? Lets say the zombies got too close, would the defeneses last?

Battle 1: Sandbags, with barb wire, and a Abatis.

2: Using the fire trucks to blockade.

3: Police cars, and barbwire.


All more than sufficient since the zombies will never reach those anyway.

#45 Red Blue Blur

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 09:13 AM

In a true zombie epidemic the solfiers would fight the zombies attacking but they would never win. Some survivors would be infected and will eventually change. Some soildiers will change and attack after the fight. Some zombies that arent real smart will not know how to get to the soldiers and the troxin zombies will be smart enough to hide until the time is right.

Also the troxin zombies could trun on some of there own burning them and letting the troxin smoke be carried into the soldiers and survivors, infecting them all.

#46 Ruinus

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 09:48 AM

In a real conflict against zombies they would lose since their bodies would rot, and their method of reproduction relies entirely on attacking the singlemost successful apex predator in the history of the world. In cold areas the weather itself would kill them, and their stench would give them away.

#47 Jason Redfield

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 03:11 PM

In a real conflict against zombies they would lose since their bodies would rot, and their method of reproduction relies entirely on attacking the singlemost successful apex predator in the history of the world. In cold areas the weather itself would kill them, and their stench would give them away.


Someone's read the Cracked article, if I'm not mistaken. B)

#48 Ruinus

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 06:26 PM

Yeah, but the Cracked article, at that point, was just telling me something I already knew. Zombies aren't dangerous. All the - of the Dead movies aren't about the uber danger zombies pose, they're about the danger humans pose when they sell each other out for their own selfish means.

Really, zombies vs military should always be re-written as "drunk limping men vs military".

#49 Red Blue Blur

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 06:30 PM

In a real conflict against zombies they would lose since their bodies would rot, and their method of reproduction relies entirely on attacking the singlemost successful apex predator in the history of the world. In cold areas the weather itself would kill them, and their stench would give them away.

The bodies wouldnt rot that fast. It would take a couple of years for that to happen. Also since zombies are always brought on by some magical or unexplained scientific reason who says they will rot at all. Those properties that brought the dead to life could keep them preserved as well.

Also what makes zombies so scary is that the epidemic almost always seems to spread over night. It shows how when something dramatic happens people begin to panick. It shows how in real life most people will only look out for themselves and forsake all others.

#50 Ruinus

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 07:38 PM

The bodies wouldnt rot that fast. It would take a couple of years for that to happen. Also since zombies are always brought on by some magical or unexplained scientific reason who says they will rot at all. Those properties that brought the dead to life could keep them preserved as well.


States of Decomposition: Warning: Nasty images of dead pig decomposition.
I have no clue what meat you buy that takes a couple of years to rot away.

Their bodies never heal. That means they are rotting. Rotting meat attracts bugs and all types of insects that eat dead meat, as well as bacteria (such as the ones already in our stomach) that grow on dead meat. Since they can't heal their bodies, they have no way of fighting off infections, nor do they swat flies away to stop them from laying eggs on their body.

They don't drink water, so their bodies are going to dehydrate. They have no active defense against the cold, so they'll freeze.

Animals, such as coyotes, bears, or even stray dogs suddenly become major threats to them, because on normal conditions they can harm a person. But now the person is slower, stupid, and can't heal from bites.

Also what makes zombies so scary is that the epidemic almost always seems to spread over night.


I admit, the way no movie ever attempts to show how the zombies first appear is kinda scary. It wouldn't be so scary if all the cementaries suddenly start sprouting zombies-which are immediately cut down then the police simply quarantine the cementary would it?

It shows how when something dramatic happens people begin to panick. It shows how in real life most people will only look out for themselves and forsake all others.


Yes. I know this.
Because I just said it in my above post.

#51 Scar

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 08:05 PM

Our military? Afraid of zombies? Really? The same men and women who have shown time and time again that they can be capable of feats of heroism worthy of being captured in stone? The same men and woman who fight day and night across the ocean so that others may live a safe life back home? The same men and woman who have been shown to at a moments notice know no hesitation to sacrifice their lives so that others may live?

You people must be talking about some other military. Because there is sure no way in hell that when the safety of the American people is put in obvious danger, that our finest, our strongest and our greatest will ever turn tail and run.

U.S ARMED FORCES FOR THE GOD DAMN RED WHITE AND BLUE MOTHER *vulgarity*ING STOMP!!!!

#52 ND7

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 08:14 PM

Our military? Afraid of zombies? Really? The same men and women who have shown time and time again that they can be capable of feats of heroism worthy of being captured in stone? The same men and woman who fight day and night across the ocean so that others may live a safe life back home? The same men and woman who have been shown to at a moments notice know no hesitation to sacrifice their lives so that others may live?

You people must be talking about some other military. Because there is sure no way in hell that when the safety of the American people is put in obvious danger, that our finest, our strongest and our greatest will ever turn tail and run.

U.S ARMED FORCES FOR THE GOD DAMN RED WHITE AND BLUE MOTHER *vulgarity*ING STOMP!!!!

Hey..I had a uncle in the milltary, his name was Uncle Chili, who served in the Vietnam War, his entire squad except for him and his second in command, and they were captured. He escaped and for a while kept on fighting, until he got released at the end of the war. My grandmother told me he was never the same...he died before I was born....my grandma says he commited suicide...

But....can you please put more elaborate reasons, other than that our miltary is the best?

#53 Scar

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 08:27 PM

Hey..I had a uncle in the milltary, his name was Uncle Chili, who served in the Vietnam War, his entire squad except for him and his second in command, and they were captured. He escaped and for a while kept on fighting, until he got released at the end of the war. My grandmother told me he was never the same...he died before I was born....my grandma says he commited suicide...

But....can you please put more elaborate reasons, other than that our miltary is the best?


Well for one the belief that trained soldiers will balk and run in the face of zombies, is ridiculous. Furthermore, the walking dead in the real world would be nowhere near as physically stable as in works fiction. Within no more then several weeks they'd have rotten away to the point where they're just bones, or in case of frozen climates, hypothermia will set in and kill off their nerves even faster. They may be zombies, but they move and operate just like the rest of us, through the electronic signals sent out through their body via the brain. No way to send those signals, no way for them to move around.

And as for this whole "shoot them in the head or no go", that's a load of crap as well. Sure you can't "kill" them, but a good spread of automatic fire will stop them from advancing, or at least slow them down *considerably* Also, at least for the slow and disoriented ones, just traveling across natural landscape alone will be neigh impossible. Depending on where you set the engagement they won't even be able to reach the troops. Hell, a good steep incline will be impossible for them to navigate up.

With the proper strategical mind to lead our troops against the undead, we really have no other outcome but total annihilation.

#54 Red Blue Blur

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 10:08 PM

Well for one the belief that trained soldiers will balk and run in the face of zombies, is ridiculous. Furthermore, the walking dead in the real world would be nowhere near as physically stable as in works fiction. Within no more then several weeks they'd have rotten away to the point where they're just bones, or in case of frozen climates, hypothermia will set in and kill off their nerves even faster. They may be zombies, but they move and operate just like the rest of us, through the electronic signals sent out through their body via the brain. No way to send those signals, no way for them to move around.

And as for this whole "shoot them in the head or no go", that's a load of crap as well. Sure you can't "kill" them, but a good spread of automatic fire will stop them from advancing, or at least slow them down *considerably* Also, at least for the slow and disoriented ones, just traveling across natural landscape alone will be neigh impossible. Depending on where you set the engagement they won't even be able to reach the troops. Hell, a good steep incline will be impossible for them to navigate up.

With the proper strategical mind to lead our troops against the undead, we really have no other outcome but total annihilation.

not that the troops couldnt take on the zombies but the question is will they get the resources and man power to handle the threat. It could be like Somalia whne clinton kinda left our troops out to dry getting many killed when we should have been able to walk in and out untouched. With the amount of troops against zombies I believe the troops would win but in a large city I believe the actual numbers would be different. In a city the numbers would be more like 1 to 2 million zombies vs 1 to 2 thousand troops.

#55 Ruinus

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 12:07 AM

not that the troops couldnt take on the zombies but the question is will they get the resources and man power to handle the threat. It could be like Somalia whne clinton kinda left our troops out to dry getting many killed when we should have been able to walk in and out untouched. With the amount of troops against zombies I believe the troops would win but in a large city I believe the actual numbers would be different. In a city the numbers would be more like 1 to 2 million zombies vs 1 to 2 thousand troops.


Yes, they would get the manpower to kill reanimated dead, because unlike Somalia, where there are complex political decisions at play no one gives a shit if the US military starts killing zombies left and right. They are pests, there'd be no political or social roadblocks stopping the military from killing them, so there is no reason to think they'd be understocked.

BTW there's no reason to think they'll even start running out of bullets. Zombies don't hide in cover, they don't use suppressing fire, they aren't actively attempting to make soldiers miss. They simply shamble at you at slow speeds with the co-ordination of a falling down drunk man who stinks to high heaven.

BTW: where do you get these numbers of a few thousand soldiers vs a few million zombies? I had no idea cementaries had millions of people buried in them. Even then, I still say the soldiers would kill people quite fast, seriously. They're called machine gun nests, the things that allow people to cut down entire squads or platoons of soldiers in seconds.

#56 Red Blue Blur

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 09:07 AM

Yes, they would get the manpower to kill reanimated dead, because unlike Somalia, where there are complex political decisions at play no one gives a shit if the US military starts killing zombies left and right. They are pests, there'd be no political or social roadblocks stopping the military from killing them, so there is no reason to think they'd be understocked.

BTW there's no reason to think they'll even start running out of bullets. Zombies don't hide in cover, they don't use suppressing fire, they aren't actively attempting to make soldiers miss. They simply shamble at you at slow speeds with the co-ordination of a falling down drunk man who stinks to high heaven.

BTW: where do you get these numbers of a few thousand soldiers vs a few million zombies? I had no idea cementaries had millions of people buried in them. Even then, I still say the soldiers would kill people quite fast, seriously. They're called machine gun nests, the things that allow people to cut down entire squads or platoons of soldiers in seconds.

I have conceded in this fight yes. I was simply stating a more life like scenario. If the dead rise or some kind of virus causes people to change and infect others people would panick and before the military moves in the dead will have control of most the city. (Im not talking the slow moving zombies. Im talking Dawn of the Dead sprinters.) By the time the military got to a major city there would most likely be hundreds of thousands infected by then. Also in real life people wont automatically shoot for the head to begin with. Like police and military training they will aim for center mass. They will not use grenades and AT-4s because it would damage national cities and it would look bad for the government. They would want to preserve as much as possible. Then they have to take into account that some of the survivors they are protecting are more than likely infected. They will begin to spread the disease. Then the military is stuck between the undead on both sides. In the mass panick people will look out for number one. Also with threats posed directly to your own family you have to think of how many will return home to protect there wives, kids, mothers, and fathers. Everything would quickly fall apart. (Again Im not talking about the staggering zombies. Im talking about the more realistic zombies that dont come from the grave but it all starts from some unknown disease. These zombies come full sprinting, can climb, and open unlocked doors.

#57 Ruinus

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 05:44 PM

Realistic zombies can be killed by shooting them anywhere, it's called loss of blood and massive trauma. Also, realistic zombies would be easy to kill because of starvation or dehydration, two days in hot areas or a month in cold areas, though in cold areas these "zombies" would die because of the extreme cold.

Grenades and rocket launchers aren't going to be causing mass damage to cities, they'll shatter windows, mess up a few walls with marks, or similar, but the cost of using such weapons to quickly dispatch what are basically rioting people will be lower than not using them.

#58 Red Blue Blur

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 09:54 PM

Realistic zombies can be killed by shooting them anywhere, it's called loss of blood and massive trauma. Also, realistic zombies would be easy to kill because of starvation or dehydration, two days in hot areas or a month in cold areas, though in cold areas these "zombies" would die because of the extreme cold.

Grenades and rocket launchers aren't going to be causing mass damage to cities, they'll shatter windows, mess up a few walls with marks, or similar, but the cost of using such weapons to quickly dispatch what are basically rioting people will be lower than not using them.

You must really trust the government to act on major disasters huh? From past events I just dont see the military winning in a real situation. Mostly because they would not come in until it was too late. Katrina, Somalia, and etc.

#59 Jason Redfield

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 10:34 PM

You must really trust the government to act on major disasters huh? From past events I just dont see the military winning in a real situation. Mostly because they would not come in until it was too late. Katrina, Somalia, and etc.


Not even comparable. This is a combat-based scenario against a rather inadequate enemy. Not a natural disaster. Would there be chaos? Sure. But if there's something our military (or just about any other, for that matter) excels at, it's fighting. And fighting zombies barely qualifies for the term. There'd be some cleaning up to do afterwards, but I'm confident that any zombie outbreak would be put down in time. It's the human factor and chaos that would get us, but even that wouldn't be society-ending.

As for Somalia -- the Marines did their job and did it well. Aidid knew better than to mess with them. Afterwards, Task Force Ranger did their jobs well. It's not their fault Bill decided to pull everyone out prematurely. There's still a lot people out there of the opinion that the U.S. was responsible for killing Aidid later on.

#60 Red Blue Blur

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 11:56 AM

Not even comparable. This is a combat-based scenario against a rather inadequate enemy. Not a natural disaster. Would there be chaos? Sure. But if there's something our military (or just about any other, for that matter) excels at, it's fighting. And fighting zombies barely qualifies for the term. There'd be some cleaning up to do afterwards, but I'm confident that any zombie outbreak would be put down in time. It's the human factor and chaos that would get us, but even that wouldn't be society-ending.

As for Somalia -- the Marines did their job and did it well. Aidid knew better than to mess with them. Afterwards, Task Force Ranger did their jobs well. It's not their fault Bill decided to pull everyone out prematurely. There's still a lot people out there of the opinion that the U.S. was responsible for killing Aidid later on.

Yes the soldiers did awesome with what they were given but that was the problem. The government didnt provide what they NEEDED and that in lies the problem. Because of government formalities the soldiers in a zombie attack might not get the manpower or resources needed.

For probably a week or two it would be completely up to riot officers to "control the rioters" Which in turn would allow the infection to quickly spread throughout the city. I just see the zombie numbers overwhelming before the military ever shows up. Then they get overwhelmed before more soldiers arrive and the epidemic continues to spread.




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